From ab4el@ab4el.com Sat May 18 00:00 EDT 1996
From: Stephen Modena <modena@SunSITE.unc.edu>
Message-Id: <96051801.modena@sunsite.unc.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L LOG9511
Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 00:01:00 -0400 (EDT)
This is the compendium of SALINITY-L digests for November 1995.
It was prepared from the daily digest mailings. Some digests
may be missing, because occasional mailings are lost en route.
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Wed Nov 1 14:36 EST 1995
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 08:28:28 -0600
Message-Id: <199511011428.AA14687@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 12
Contents:
Re: Aussie salinity traveller comes home (Keith Smettem <hydsol@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>)
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 14:33:29 +0800 (WST)
From: Keith Smettem <hydsol@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Aussie salinity traveller comes home
Hi Richard, Pleased to know you are back! Neil has finished the EM-38
report. Has he sent you a copy? Keith
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Fri Nov 3 00:52 EST 1995
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 18:44:20 -0600
Message-Id: <199511030044.AA24492@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 13
Contents:
(Ann-Marie Boland <BOLANDA@salty.agvic.gov.au>)
Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 09:25:30 +0000
From: Ann-Marie Boland <BOLANDA@salty.agvic.gov.au>
Subject:
Anne-Maree Boland
I am a horticultural research scientist in Australia with the
Victorian Department of Agriculture located at the Institute of
Sustainable Irrigated Agriculture (ISIA), Tatura.
My research is concerned with the effects of salinity and shallow
water tables on productivity of perennial fruit trees (mainly stone
and pome fruit). Regions of south-eastern Australia suffer from high
irrigation/soil salinity and/or shallow water tables. Most growers
are converting to micro-irrigation to improve irrigation efficiency
and better manage salinity.
Our research program has been assessing salt tolerance of peach and
also the dual influence of water tables and salinity. We are
currently looking at the sensitivity to salt at different stages of
fruit development. In the future we wish to explore further the long-
term accumulation and toxic effects of salts in perennial
horticulture.
We would be interested in discussion related to salt tolerance of
perennial horticulture and the issues described above.
The Tatura institute has a major research program devoted to
salinity/sodicity issues.
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Sat Nov 4 00:52 EST 1995
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 18:44:52 -0600
Message-Id: <199511040044.AA18582@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 14
Contents:
New member - Salinity tolerance (<NEBO@scientia.up.ac.za>)
New member. (x426835@aix1.ucv.cl (Cristian Chaparro E))
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 12:37:29 GMT+2
From: <NEBO@scientia.up.ac.za>
Subject: New member - Salinity tolerance
Dear SALINITY-L subscribers,
My name is Nebojsa Jovanovic, I am originally from Serbia, PhD
student at the University of Pretoria, RSA (my promoter is Dr. J.G.
Annandale).
I am currently busy modelling crop growth under salinity conditions.
Is there anybody that could give information about the increase in
root resistance to water flow due to presence of salts in the soil
solution (explanation of the phenomenon, quantification etc.)?
Thank you
Nebojsa Jovanovic
Dept. Plant Production & Soil Science
University of Pretoria
0002 Hatfield
RSA
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 20:24:35 +22320252 (CDT)
From: x426835@aix1.ucv.cl (Cristian Chaparro E)
Subject: New member.
Hello suscribers,
I'm Cristian Chaparro, an Agronomy student at the Catholic University of
Valparaiso, Chile. At present I'm working on a research in order to get my
Bachelors degree. This research is part of an investigation developed by
Mrs. Graciela Munoz who is a genetics teacher from de Biological Sciences
Department of our University.
In this research we will evaluate the response to salinity stress at
molecular and fisiological level in Vitis plants that show resistance to
this condition. We are going to use Protein Banding and Electronic
microscopy to evaluate the differences between the treated and non treated
plants.
As you can see, I have no experience in the field of salinity, but I'm
looking forward to acquire some experience through this research. And of
course I will be expecting comments, sugestion and remarks of any kind
related to my work.
My expectations for this list? Well, an open space to settle some
questions, generous minds that share their knowledge and from those who
have walked a long way before us in the salinity pathway, their wisdom.
My best regards,
Cristian Chaparro E.
Catholic University of Valparaiso
Fax: 56-2-2181591
E-mail: x426835@aix1.ucv.cl
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Thu Nov 9 04:10 EST 1995
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 22:02:01 -0600
Message-Id: <199511090402.AA19343@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 15
Contents:
(cole.phil@wpo.pi.sa.gov.au)
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 1995 14:33:21 +0930
From: cole.phil@wpo.pi.sa.gov.au
Subject:
Can anyone provide me with information on the salinity tolerance
of chinese dates? This fruit tree (not a date palm) has fruits
somewhat similar to dates in both appearance and taste; I think
it would be deciduous; and is grown quite widely in moderately
saline soils in Shandong Province. I do not know the generic
name.
-----------------------------------------------------------
* Phil Cole *
* *
* Program Manager, Water Management *
* Sustainable Resources Group *
* Primary Industries (SA) *
* *
* E-mail: (Internet); cole.phil@pi.sa.gov.au *
* *
* Addr: GPO Box 1671, Adelaide, South Australia, 5001 *
* Phone: 61 8 303 9528 Fax : 61 8 303 9555 *
-----------------------------------------------------------
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Fri Nov 10 04:10 EST 1995
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 22:02:12 -0600
Message-Id: <199511100402.AA16689@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 16
Contents:
Iron precipitate (sjordan@seldon.terminus.com (Steve Jordan))
Re: Iron precipitate (pdspyke@gate.net)
Re: Iron precipitate (sjordan@seldon.terminus.com (Steve Jordan))
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 22:13:36 -0800
From: sjordan@seldon.terminus.com (Steve Jordan)
Subject: Iron precipitate
I have install underground low flow drip tape. I use several (6 or more)
wells in various drip fields. I have a problem. Certain water supplies
are higher in iron. The above ground pipes are stained, the drip hoses ends
have a reddish brown "pudding", we find find reddish powder in the tape
itself. (rust).
The original drip wells have a much lower iron problem, but it can get bad.
One well have 5.0 ppm iron. The best is around 1.2 ppm.
Book says solution:
1. Aerate (reservoir) and precipitate.
2. Or .. pH to 4.0 (expensive and bad for crops)
3. Polyphosphate / polymoleic acid / Phosphonate.
Apparently the problem is a little deeper (pardon the pun). I have iron
reducing "bacteria". This bacteria enhances the conversion (oxidation) of
the ferrous to ferric.
One suggestion: chlorinate in front of filters and that oxidizes the iron
and it precipitates (I dont know if it works that fast)
Other suggestion: treat the well to kill or more likely suppress the
bacteria. Then treat the water with phosphonte (CH20's sure flow). If that
treatment is right then how do I know it works? My off the wall thought is
that the backflush will stop being red would be a good first sign.
Steve Jordan @ Second Foundation
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 15:33:47 -0500
From: pdspyke@gate.net
Subject: Re: Iron precipitate
>I have install underground low flow drip tape. I use several (6 or more)
>wells in various drip fields. I have a problem. Certain water supplies
>are higher in iron. The above ground pipes are stained, the drip hoses ends
>have a reddish brown "pudding", we find find reddish powder in the tape
>itself. (rust).
>
>The original drip wells have a much lower iron problem, but it can get bad.
>One well have 5.0 ppm iron. The best is around 1.2 ppm.
>
>Book says solution:
>
>1. Aerate (reservoir) and precipitate.
>2. Or .. pH to 4.0 (expensive and bad for crops)
>3. Polyphosphate / polymoleic acid / Phosphonate.
>
>Apparently the problem is a little deeper (pardon the pun). I have iron
>reducing "bacteria". This bacteria enhances the conversion (oxidation) of
>the ferrous to ferric.
>One suggestion: chlorinate in front of filters and that oxidizes the iron
>and it precipitates (I dont know if it works that fast)
>
>Other suggestion: treat the well to kill or more likely suppress the
>bacteria. Then treat the water with phosphonte (CH20's sure flow). If that
>treatment is right then how do I know it works? My off the wall thought is
>that the backflush will stop being red would be a good first sign.
We run microjet and drip systems in citrus in Florida. I have done quite
a bit of work on irrigation system plugging. I have found that one critical
technique necessary for control of iron reducing bacterial slimes is to
avoid air leaks on the suction side of the pump. In EVERY case where
this has been a SEVERE problem, there were air leaks. This introduces
oxygen into the water (there is very low dissolved oxygen in wells).
The presence of oxygen speeds up the reaction greatly.
Fixing the air leaks may not eliminate the problem, but it will certainly
reduce it. Possibly it will drop back enough for you to live with it
without treatment. At any rate, it will improve things.
Remember, that's on the SUCTION side of the pump. Leaks on the
pressure side don't matter (they're usually water leaks anyway).
Pete Spyke
>
>Steve Jordan @ Second Foundation
>
>
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 19:07:06 -0800
From: sjordan@seldon.terminus.com (Steve Jordan)
Subject: Re: Iron precipitate
>We run microjet and drip systems in citrus in Florida. I have done quite
>a bit of work on irrigation system plugging. I have found that one critical
>technique necessary for control of iron reducing bacterial slimes is to
>avoid air leaks on the suction side of the pump. In EVERY case where
>this has been a SEVERE problem, there were air leaks. This introduces
>oxygen into the water (there is very low dissolved oxygen in wells).
>The presence of oxygen speeds up the reaction greatly.
>
>Fixing the air leaks may not eliminate the problem, but it will certainly
>reduce it. Possibly it will drop back enough for you to live with it
>without treatment. At any rate, it will improve things.
>
>Remember, that's on the SUCTION side of the pump. Leaks on the
>pressure side don't matter (they're usually water leaks anyway).
>
>Pete Spyke
>
That is true. Also cascading water will get those bacteria going.
Cascading means water falling from the perforations. Another source is
reverse flow or water flowing backwards into a well. Both of these problems
are solvable by proper design. No pumps below the top of perforations and
proper (and properly maintaned!!) check valves.
Of course, scaling reduces well output which drops the water level which
induces air leaks (breaking air) which causes MORE scaling.
Assuming that I fix it so that breaking suction et al problems are
minimized, what is the best way to kill bacteria? What is the best way to
monitor bacteria and iron control?
Is my theory that the red cloudy stuff in backflush really rust (and
bacteria?) and with proper control and maintanence I should be seing no red???
Steve Jordan @ Second Foundation
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Sat Nov 11 04:13 EST 1995
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 22:02:43 -0600
Message-Id: <199511110402.AB19578@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 17
Contents:
Introduction message (elson@Civil01.coc.ufrj.br (Elson Nascimento))
Re: Iron precipitate (pdspyke@gate.net)
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 16:50:37 +0300
From: elson@Civil01.coc.ufrj.br (Elson Nascimento)
Subject: Introduction message
Dear fellows,
I am pleased to subscribe SALINITY-L.
I am a doctorate student at the Federal University of Rio de Janeiro
(http:\\www.ufrj.br). My Thesis Project is on "Numerical modeling applied to environmental problems due to soil and water management" Key words: Modeling, groundwater, environment,salinity and irrigation.
I hope we can change good experiences in this List,
Regards,
Elson.
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 22:04:03 -0500
From: pdspyke@gate.net
Subject: Re: Iron precipitate
>>We run microjet and drip systems in citrus in Florida. I have done quite
>>a bit of work on irrigation system plugging. I have found that one critical
>>technique necessary for control of iron reducing bacterial slimes is to
>>avoid air leaks on the suction side of the pump. In EVERY case where
>>this has been a SEVERE problem, there were air leaks. This introduces
>>oxygen into the water (there is very low dissolved oxygen in wells).
>>The presence of oxygen speeds up the reaction greatly.
>>
>>Fixing the air leaks may not eliminate the problem, but it will certainly
>>reduce it. Possibly it will drop back enough for you to live with it
>>without treatment. At any rate, it will improve things.
>>
>>Remember, that's on the SUCTION side of the pump. Leaks on the
>>pressure side don't matter (they're usually water leaks anyway).
>>
>>Pete Spyke
>>
>
>That is true. Also cascading water will get those bacteria going.
>Cascading means water falling from the perforations. Another source is
>reverse flow or water flowing backwards into a well. Both of these problems
>are solvable by proper design. No pumps below the top of perforations and
>proper (and properly maintaned!!) check valves.
>
>Of course, scaling reduces well output which drops the water level which
>induces air leaks (breaking air) which causes MORE scaling.
>
>Assuming that I fix it so that breaking suction et al problems are
>minimized, what is the best way to kill bacteria? What is the best way to
>monitor bacteria and iron control?
>
>Is my theory that the red cloudy stuff in backflush really rust (and
>bacteria?) and with proper control and maintanence I should be seing no red???
>Steve Jordan @ Second Foundation
It's hard to answer all of this specifically, of course, without water tests.
So, I will again generalize a bit.
The bacteria actually needs a ferrous, rather than ferric, source of iron
in order to reduce it. If your water has ferric iron, the red color you
see is merely a buildup of that, and it's not really harmful or alarming.
Normally of course you see the ferric iron stain around the discharge
point of the emitters since it is oxidizing there in the air.
If you have ferrous iron, then the residue you are seeing may very
well be bacterial slime. This is important. If the bacteria are active,
you will NOT see an iron precipitate or oxidant -- the problem will
be sort of a light- to dark-brown slimy mass. This is actually the
bacterial cells, which are coated with a slimy substance, which have
multiplied in the system. Since they are using the ferrous iron only
for reduction, the material is not actually an iron compound.
So, that's the way to tell. If what you see is a red-colored residue,
you don't necessarily have a bacterial problem. If it is a slimy
mass (called iron ochre), you do have bacteria. Again, air leaks
on the suction side of the pump will compound the latter situation
monumentally.
The normal treatment is chlorine, which is actually used as a
bactericide. You need about 1-5 ppm of FREE chlorine
at the end of the lines, with an exposure time of about 30 minutes.
This will kill the bacteria. The amount of TOTAL chlorine
will depend on the chemistry of the water -- a certain amount
of chlorine will be tied up as a precipitate with salts in the water.
You need to add enough to have about 1-5 ppm of actual chlorine
left over as free chlorine.
You can get a free chlorine test kit from the Hach company.
Costs about $30.00. Ask any chemical lab for a catalogue
or phone number. You have to get it through mail order.
Pool test kits don't work -- they test for a different form
of chlorine.
I use sodium hypochlorite for the injection. I think it's 5%
chlorine. I get it from the company in town that sells
industrial cleaning supplies.
Hope this helps.
Pete Spyke
>
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Mon Nov 13 04:04 EST 1995
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 21:51:49 -0600
Message-Id: <199511130351.AA16008@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 18
Contents:
AUSTRALIAN CONFERENCE (Mike Schulz <SCHULZM@salty.agvic.gov.au>)
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 14:51:46 +0000
From: Mike Schulz <SCHULZM@salty.agvic.gov.au>
Subject: AUSTRALIAN CONFERENCE
As our server has been malfunctioning (apparently for several
months), i'm resending this intro and info.
The National Comm. for Rehabilitation & Productive Use of Saline Land
(Australia) is organising their fourth National Workshop for March 25-
29 1996 in Albany (Western Austra;ia). The sessions include;
*Extent of saline land
*Fodder production
*Other productive uses (trees)
*Water table control
*Nature conservation
*Impact on communities
*Irrigation with saline water
Pre, Post and Mid Conference tours are available.
For further info contact
Promaco Conventions Pty Ltd.
PO Box 890, Canning Bridge
WESTERN AUSTRALIA, 6153
Tel 61 9 364 8311
Fax 61 9 316 1453
email promaco@cleo.murdoch.edu.au
The deadline for abstracts was Nov 1.
******** QUESTION**********
i need information on the rooting pattern &/or depth of Leptochloa
Fusca (syn. Diplachne fusca). There are rheims of papers on the
species but none that i've found mention its roots.
Schulzzzzzzz............
Inst. of Sustainable Irrigated Agriculture - Tatura
Agriculture Victoria
Department of Agriculture Energy and Minerals
Government of Victoria
Australia
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Tue Nov 14 15:09 EST 1995
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 09:01:35 -0600
Message-Id: <199511141501.AA16276@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 19
Contents:
very late responce (Anatole M. Zeiliguer <zeiligue@mgmi.msk.su>)
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 17:18:14 +0300
From: Anatole M. Zeiliguer <zeiligue@mgmi.msk.su>
Subject: very late responce
Re: Use of SALT model
Dear Phil,
Unfortunately I can't directly answer in our question because my ignorance
of our research problem. view of experimental data function, equation fitted
and program NOPT used.
I have any experience in the using of nonlinear optimization with the
residual sum of squares method for adjust parameters of the curvilinear
equation although the experimental soil hydraulic properties data. In
accordance with my experience your mishap can provide due or discordance
of experimental and fitted function, or weak expressiveness of experimental
data function (for example - cloud view), or not sensitivity of the residual
sum squares to any experimental data (very small/great in comparison with
other). In these case it possible search the special solutions one of these
is the parameters fixing that we use.
For more profound analysis I need some of your experimental data
and equation used for fitting.
Regards,
Anatole
Name: Anatole Zeiliguer
Address: The Moscow State University of Environmental Engineering -
Prirodoobustroistva, (MGMI), Prjanishnikof Street, 19,
127550 Moscow, Russia.
E-mail : Zeiliguer@mgmi.msk.su (Zeiliguer Anatole)
Fax : 7095-292-65-11 BOX 10818 MELIORACIA
Tel (residence): 7095-153-44-33
Tel (office): 7095-976-22-01
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Fri Nov 17 18:53 EST 1995
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 12:07:08 -0600
Message-Id: <199511161807.AA01421@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 20
Contents:
Iron precipitate (sstyles@oboe.aix.calpoly.edu (Stuart W. Styles))
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 10:08:24 -0800
From: sstyles@oboe.aix.calpoly.edu (Stuart W. Styles)
Subject: Iron precipitate
I forwarded the following e-mail to Charles Burt. I had a question
regarding using inexpensive swimming pool kits for checking chlorine since
I recommend growers use it for testing. His response follows.
Stuart Styles (sstyles@oboe.aix.calpoly.edu)
Original message:
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 20:57:21 -0600
Originator: salinity-l@unl.edu
From: pdspyke@gate.net
Subject: Re: Iron precipitate
>>>>We run microjet and drip systems in citrus in Florida. I have done quite
>>>>a bit of work on irrigation system plugging. I have found that one critical
>>>>technique necessary for control of iron reducing bacterial slimes is to
>>>>avoid air leaks on the suction side of the pump. In EVERY case where
>>>>this has been a SEVERE problem, there were air leaks. This introduces
>>>>oxygen into the water (there is very low dissolved oxygen in wells).
>>>>The presence of oxygen speeds up the reaction greatly.
>>>>
>>>>Fixing the air leaks may not eliminate the problem, but it will certainly
>>>>reduce it. Possibly it will drop back enough for you to live with it
>>>>without treatment. At any rate, it will improve things.
>>>>
>>>>Remember, that's on the SUCTION side of the pump. Leaks on the
>>>>pressure side don't matter (they're usually water leaks anyway).
>>>>
>>>>Pete Spyke
>>>>
>>>
>>>That is true. Also cascading water will get those bacteria going.
>>>Cascading means water falling from the perforations. Another source is
>>>reverse flow or water flowing backwards into a well. Both of these problems
>>>are solvable by proper design. No pumps below the top of perforations and
>>>proper (and properly maintaned!!) check valves.
>>>
>>>Of course, scaling reduces well output which drops the water level which
>>>induces air leaks (breaking air) which causes MORE scaling.
>>>
>>>Assuming that I fix it so that breaking suction et al problems are
>>>minimized, what is the best way to kill bacteria? What is the best way to
>>>monitor bacteria and iron control?
>>>
>>>Is my theory that the red cloudy stuff in backflush really rust (and
>>>bacteria?) and with proper control and maintanence I should be seing no
>>>red???
>>>Steve Jordan @ Second Foundation
>>
>>It's hard to answer all of this specifically, of course, without water tests.
>>So, I will again generalize a bit.
>>
>>The bacteria actually needs a ferrous, rather than ferric, source of iron
>>in order to reduce it. If your water has ferric iron, the red color you
>>see is merely a buildup of that, and it's not really harmful or alarming.
>>Normally of course you see the ferric iron stain around the discharge
>>point of the emitters since it is oxidizing there in the air.
>>
>>If you have ferrous iron, then the residue you are seeing may very
>>well be bacterial slime. This is important. If the bacteria are active,
>>you will NOT see an iron precipitate or oxidant -- the problem will
>>be sort of a light- to dark-brown slimy mass. This is actually the
>>bacterial cells, which are coated with a slimy substance, which have
>>multiplied in the system. Since they are using the ferrous iron only
>>for reduction, the material is not actually an iron compound.
>>
>>So, that's the way to tell. If what you see is a red-colored residue,
>>you don't necessarily have a bacterial problem. If it is a slimy
>>mass (called iron ochre), you do have bacteria. Again, air leaks
>>on the suction side of the pump will compound the latter situation
>>monumentally.
>>
>>The normal treatment is chlorine, which is actually used as a
>>bactericide. You need about 1-5 ppm of FREE chlorine
>>at the end of the lines, with an exposure time of about 30 minutes.
>>This will kill the bacteria. The amount of TOTAL chlorine
>>will depend on the chemistry of the water -- a certain amount
>>of chlorine will be tied up as a precipitate with salts in the water.
>>You need to add enough to have about 1-5 ppm of actual chlorine
>>left over as free chlorine.
>>
>>You can get a free chlorine test kit from the Hach company.
>>Costs about $30.00. Ask any chemical lab for a catalogue
>>or phone number. You have to get it through mail order.
>>
>>Pool test kits don't work -- they test for a different form
>>of chlorine.
>>
>>I use sodium hypochlorite for the injection. I think it's 5%
>>chlorine. I get it from the company in town that sells
>>industrial cleaning supplies.
>>
>>Hope this helps.
>>
>>Pete Spyke
>>
>>
>>
____________________________________________________________________________
Forwarded message from Charles Burt:
I would like to clarify a few points.
First, a little bit about the words "ferric" and "ferrous"
Ferrous is iron with a +2 charge
Ferric is iron with a +3 charge
When iron is "oxidized" it loses electrons - we recognize this as it goes
from elemental iron (no charge) to rust, in which the iron has a +3 charge.
The iron bacteria are typically oxidizing bacteria, not iron reducing
bacteria. Therefore, if the iron is in the "ferrous" form in a well, it
can serve as an energy source for bacteria, which oxidize it to the
"ferric" form.
This reaction can also occur chemically, without bacteria (just as rust
forms without bacteria). We cause this to occur sometimes by aerating the
well water in reservoirs before pumping into drip systems.
Basically, if the problem is iron bacteria, you need to treat the well.
City water systems do this all the time. When treating the well at first,
there may be large amounts of "rust" and bacteria housing which are pumped
up, so you need a good filter or else you need to discharge the water to
the atmosphere. After the initial treatment, you should have periodic
maintenance (chemical) on the well. Well companies often have specialists
in this. I know that Layne has a specialist in Oklahoma City or Kansas
City who deals with this problem full time. Layne also uses the "Barts"
test (a test involving applying small amounts of well water into small
containers of gel, in which the bateria grow and exhibit various visual
symptoms, by which you can identify the type). That test kit is also
distributed by DESI in Phoenix (800-334-6236).
One way of keeping the iron as individual molecules is to use the new
compounds such as polymaleic acid or various long chain linear
polyphosphates, which act as chelates and keep the iron in solution. That
doesn't help if the bacteria have already oxidized the bacteria, and if the
slime coming from the wells is the problem.
Finally, there is the question of the type of chlorine test kit to use.
This is a question which requires some judgment.
Note that the recommendations are that one needs somewhere between 1 to 5
ppm of free residual chlorine. That's a 500% difference. The conclusion
should be that a test kit which covers about 80% of what you want is
probably good enough, especially if it's easy to get and simple to use and
cheap.
It's true that many swimming pool test kits do not tell you what part of
the total chlorine is free residual chlorine, as will a Hach Test Kit.
However, others do this. I suggest that you buy the more expensive test
kit and compare it with the El Cheapo. Make up your own mind about
accuracy and how much it's worth, especially in light of the 500%
difference in dosage recommendations.
The bottom line on this is that you should reduce the chlorine applications
as far as possible and still remove the problem.
Charles Burt
Director, Irrigation Training and Research Center
Cal Poly
San Luis Obispo, CA 93407
cburt@oboe.aix.calpoly.edu
End of Digest
************************
From root@crcnis1.unl.edu Fri Nov 17 18:41 EST 1995
Date: Fri, 17 Nov 1995 12:33:34 -0600
Message-Id: <199511171833.AA23759@crcnis1.unl.edu>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 21
Contents:
Re: Iron precipitate (sjordan@seldon.terminus.com (Steve Jordan))
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 22:52:40 -0800
From: sjordan@seldon.terminus.com (Steve Jordan)
Subject: Re: Iron precipitate
>Basically, if the problem is iron bacteria, you need to treat the well.
>City water systems do this all the time. When treating the well at first,
>there may be large amounts of "rust" and bacteria housing which are pumped
>
Iron is a _big_ problem for cities, especially here on the coast of California.
>One way of keeping the iron as individual molecules is to use the new
>compounds such as polymaleic acid or various long chain linear
>polyphosphates, which act as chelates and keep the iron in solution. That
>doesn't help if the bacteria have already oxidized the bacteria, and if the
>slime coming from the wells is the problem.
>
There are two competing technologies. The polymaleic acid / polyphosphates
is one. The other is phosphonate. Both work in a similar concentration but
use different methods. The phosphonate is more of a dispersant and the
other is a sequestring agent. Or is it the other way around. The
phosphonate (CH2O- Sureflow) people claim to be more compatible with calcium
and phosphate fertilizers and more effective against iron. The others have
a California track record and some testimonials. I am trying both.
Conclusions so far? Once the iron settles out neither works. Yep, they
claim some cleanup possibilities, but the flows are the same. It was a long
shot.
I think once the iron goes to ferric and starts settling there is no hope
other than oxidation and settling ponds. The small rust particles can fit
through the filter and stick later on.
I think the slimes are a "secondary" infestation problem. I think if I fix
the well and sequester or disperse the iron, the slime will have nothing to
grow on.
1. Treat the well.
2. Treat the water.
>The bottom line on this is that you should reduce the chlorine applications
>as far as possible and still remove the problem.
>
Good suggestion. Do you need to chlorinate habitually? Always? Or only if
a chronic algae problem? Or a chronic slime problem?
Steve Jordan @ Second Foundation
End of Digest
************************
From ab4el@ab4el.com Fri Nov 24 18:41 EST 1995
Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 12:33:34 -0600
Message-Id: <19951124.ab4el@ab4el.com>
Errors-To: rsoppe@asrr.arsusda.gov
Reply-To: <salinity-l@unl.edu>
To: Multiple recipients of list <salinity-l@unl.edu>
Subject: SALINITY-L digest 22 was NOT received
SALINITY-L digests 22 was NOT received
Prepared by Steve Modena, AB4EL.
Comments and suggestions to: modena@SUNsite.unc.edu